Ys Mafia (Current Phase: Game Over!)

[Dormio Ergo Sum]

Votecount
Fabloo (3): Polaris, Serela, NucleusWaffles
Tom (2): raikaria, Daiya
Bardiche (2): Tom, NekoNekoRex
NekoNekoRex (1): PX
Polaris (1): Disquieted
Disquieted (1): zwerdjib
raikaria (0):
PX (0):
Daiya (0):
NucleusWaffles (0):
zwerdjib (0):
meow56 (0):
Serela (0):
Yaersulf (0):
BigBangMeteor (0):

With 15 players alive, it takes 8 to lynch!
Not voting: Fabloo, meow56, Yaersulf, BigBangMeteor, banana spritzee

Time until day phase ends: [ Expired ]

[banana spritzee]

hewwo I have just subbed in and am town, give me a bit to read up

[banana spritzee]

oh i can post without verification now sweet

[zwerdjib]

hewwo I have just subbed in and am town, give me a bit to read up

never say this strawberries again

[Tom]

Yeah just because you claim town doesn't mean you are

[meow56]

Tom, I did have two more questions in my post...

banana spritzee, what experience do you have playing mafia?

[Tom]

Whose vote?  Well Bardiche's isn't that obvious from what the post is responding to?  As for who hes direction attention away from?  Himself obviously.

Now this post was a complete waste of my time as you could have easily inferred every bit of this from my original post...

[Tom]

Also, with Bardiche subbing out it makes most of that pointless so without further ado:

##Vote: Raikaria

Semilurking through the beginning of the day and has been quite vague about their intentions and alignments

[meow56]

Perhaps I should've been more clear: I'm not asking who he's directing attention away from, but rather why he's even directing attention away from himself in the first place. To be frank, I think Scum!Bardiche would've been able to handle what little heat he was getting without having to resort to redirection.

cut:

With Bardiche subbing out it makes most of that pointless

Not at all, Bardiche's actions can still give us useful insight into his (and thus his replacement's) alignment.

[Serela]

Uh. Explain?

ok so

Is it wrong of me to make assumptions and see what others think? That's been my agenda so far but it doesn't work if nobody picks up on it.

I parsed this sentence as "is it wrong of me to have opinions of others that I keep to myself while asking for other people to get their opinions on them? this has been my agenda so far but it doesn't work if no one understands and feeds me their cases on my ideal suspects"

but looking back I might have misparsed something
reading this thread more is making the headache come back every time ._. I feel ok when I'm away from mafia and then I come back and become immediately exhausted

It's just strange to me that because I said I disliked you/BBM that your instant response is that everything that lead up to that very moment was just subtext to accuse you/BBM. This isn't true at all. They were just comments I threw out to see what others would think. It turns out not so much. I actually disliked you for more individual reasons yet you seem to be associating yourself with BBM for some reason.

this was read as "What, no, I made a comment about disliking something and then shortly after said the people I disliked were Serela/BBM, but these were actually unrelated statements even though I barely gave any reason I didn't actually like Serela/BBM despite apparently having them"

also you didn't really differentiate things the stuff yourself of suspecting us with, you accused us both of ignoring questions and then really never followed up until trying to defend yourself now

...my head hurts i think i need to go back to bed again x_x

[Tom]

Perhaps I should've been more clear: I'm not asking who he's directing attention away from, but rather why he's even directing attention away from himself in the first place. To be frank, I think Scum!Bardiche would've been able to handle what little heat he was getting without having to resort to redirection.

cut:Not at all, Bardiche's actions can still give us useful insight into his (and thus his replacement's) alignment.

Okay I see, well here's my reasoning:
We didn't have any watertight evidence against each other so my strategy was just to keep pressing him until he messed up and did something outright scummy.

I think people caught on to his low quality, infrequent posts and making a big deal out of nothing in my posts here, here and here which is why he brought up my posts again to redirect attention.

[Disquieted]

I’m going back to sleep.

[Disquieted]

##Unvote
##Vote: NekoNekoRex

actually.

[BigBangMeteor]

ok I'm feeling fairly good about this ##Vote: Meow56

not only is the read list pretty empty and useless with no explanation for any of the reads, the other couple posts he made after that were regarding the Bard/Tom argument and asking Tom a bunch of questions. Although that's a major discussion point of the day so far, it's also, according to his list, a town v town fight. I think it's suspicious for that to be the core of his content vs actually pushing people he thinks are scum. Fabloo is one of his main suspicions and is very active and present and he basically hasn't said anything about or to Fabloo.

Also this is minor but it bugs me a bit that he's prioritizing responding to other people over producing his own content.

[BigBangMeteor]

I could go for NNR too actually. I wasn't really a fan of his Bard vote because it felt very barebones and kinda weird- no idea what he meant by Bard trying to obfuscate his tone. But given that I agreed with the target of the vote if not the reason I thought it was silly to pressure him at the same time as I was pressuring Bard. In his last wave of posts there was really just the one with content and it was kind of unimpressive. Didn't really like the bit about not being sure how to judge Bard for getting pissed.

NNR, when you said that Bard's post was filled with un-serious fluff, were you referring to his vote on Tom or his post about your vote on him?

[NucleusWaffles]

I genuinely feel Tom may not play by the meta, but he has a rational chain of thought which I can follow so I disagree with his lynch.

Recent activity from other zwerdijib changed my opinion substantially, I still feel town-lean for now for raikaria, NNR.

I just really don't like Fabloo's posting style, when Bard v Tom happened, he remainined in stasis.

Now that Bard has subbed out, Fabloo continues to active lurk.

[Polaris]

i have no idea how tom has displayed a rational chain of thought and i feel like everything he said on the last page (if you guys are using the same page system as i am) is a gross misrepresentation of what actually happened. this straight up does not seem like a town thing to do, let alone even a coherent thing to do

##Unvote
##Vote: Tom

please tell me if i am going insane

[Tom]

Please back up your claims with hard evidence, I included 3 links in my last post.  Everything else is just words

##Unvote
##Vote Polaris

[Tom]

Oh and did you know you can make Relative URL links by using [rurl=]?  In the BBCode editor it is the link button that shows Mima's atomic rings instead of the global link button that shows a planet~

[Tom]

Surprise!  You didn't think there was going to be another reply would you!

[BigBangMeteor]

Tom of hte people who have voted you why have you chosen to vote the people you have? Why do you think Polaris's vote (and Bard's before his) are worse than the other people who voted you?

[Tom]

I've explained my reasoning against bard, I was pressing him for a scummy slip up.
As for Polaris its purely out of spite for doing a 180 and attacking me when I thought he was friendly.  It might change into a real vote if he slips up with some scummy behavior

[NucleusWaffles]

Tom I don't think you look scum.

However, we have a tendency to lynch someone anyone really at the end of the day to provide a 'flip'.

'Flips' generate collective knowledge, in addition to the scum 'nightkill'. Two 'flips' will justify or break some town mentalities and make a good massclaim envrionment where maximum impact is shared with town but not scum.

Problem is, according to the wiki plays breaking a setup is often assumed for on modding.
Follow the Cop, as stated on the mafiascum wiki, is a effective way for a true cop and hidden doctor to break the game.


Therefore, as far as I know, even if I don't want to lynch you specifically Tom, unless you plan to claim as a doctor/cop like now since you are online. I think it is otherwise hard to convince town to swing votes entirely to another wagon.

---

To phrase that more mathematically, we as town know the probability is low for hitting scum D1.

However, in spirit of self-preservation and inducing certainty within uncertainty. Because we are what we make of ourselves, scumhunt efforts are generally rewarded, and consistency is scrutinised fiercely upon.

This is the logic of mafia, its not very mathematic, but rather a bunch of monkeys like us just competing to survive, winning comes next after we live.

So Tom, what I want to get across is try fighting for another wagon

cut1

[Polaris]

Really now?  I've been pointing at Scum!Bard the entire first day how can you even *think* of claiming I'm not hunting scum?

Here's a timeline of Tom's posts with relevant posts from Bard's also included in chronological order.

##Vote: Bardiche

I'm sorry but we don't accept lies at this town, only credit, debit, foreign currency and local currency~

Lets be more careful of pushing lurker lynches...  I get that the mafia wants to lay low and is likely to lurk but they'd also want to lynch lazy townies since they wouldn't put up much resistance.

Also wouldn't the mafia go after town power roles for their first nightkill?  So better not claim roles unless we have some way of protecting from night actions?

Although my joke on Tom was initially a joke, I am now consolidating it to a more serious vote.

##unvote
##vote: Tom

(quote cut for space)

I just read that voting lurkers is an easy way to fake scumhunt and avoid suspicion without lurking according to this Mafia Scum

But if you insist that MotK mafia behaves differently and that the odds of finding scum are higher I'm willing to vote for lurkers

What is turbolynching?

Is there a way to end day prematurely?  Like 3/4 majority?

In the rules it mentions "Twilight is the time between the hammer and the moderator's flip." so there should be a hammer?

(this is the end of the first day, marked by the prod on zwj)

Hmm, their profile page has their "last active" time as April 13, 2020, 08:21:42 PM and Day One began April 13, 2020, 09:55:26 PM which means they haven't been on at all since the game began

Nevermind, they *just* came online, likely due to the e-mail notification a PM generates

I was looking through the previous mafia game for scum tells when I saw a post by Serela and while I've been able to look up most terms on MafiaScum there was no entry on turbolynching, which is why I asked here

(quote cut for space)
Leaving my vote on Tom because I'd like for him to quit asking about game mechanics and actually weigh in with his opinion on things. Who do you think is scum, and why do you think that?

I think you are scum because you lied in your initial accusation claiming to know roles, and while it might have been a joke lies hurt the town.  Secondly you've been homing on to me more than a Hakurei Amulet, instead of going after better targets.  By your own theory you should be lynching lurkers and zwerdjib was a far better candidate even getting prodded by the mod!  Scum!Bard likely thinks I can't defend myself against his accusations because I'm new and is pushing for a mislynch.

I wasn't going to vote for anyone on day one because I don't like the odds but as long as your vote is on me, mine will be on you.

this is the first time tom ever mentions thinking that bard is scum, and it's after bard posts to restate his vote on tom.

now, the lies:

Really now?  I've been pointing at Scum!Bard the entire first day how can you even *think* of claiming I'm not hunting scum?

as i've stated previously, tom literally did not mention a single scumread during the entire first day, unless you count the initial joke vote, which i do not.

You call that serious?  I was just voicing a genuine concern besides Scum!Bard was the only one who decided to latch onto it and drive it into the ground.  It's clear as day, he saw an opening and a chance to divert attention and start a witch hunt basing its entirety on that circumstantial post.  I've read him as scum and am just pushing his buttons until he slips up and does something openly scummy

i would also use this as evidence to back up the claim that tom is not scumhunting. if tom really was "pointing at Scum!Bard the entire first day" then why did he not make any effort to respond to bard's initial serious vote? if it was "clear as day" from that post that bard was scum, why not mention it at all? the claim that "i was scumhunting all along" is patently false and your insistence on systematically attacking the people who are voting you seems almost pitiful. i am struggling to see how any of this comes from a town mindset.

[NucleusWaffles]

In addition, despite the day phase being as long as it is town is highly influenced by the number of posts and activity.

Concluded arguments with someone, today specifically referring to Bard v everyone, will lead to a hurriedness to hammer.

I am not immune to this apathy, but I hope pointing it out will dismiss some of this fake urgency and we can function better under pressure.

[Tom]

Alright, so I've figured out the best way to survive day one is to just lurk since without data everything is meaningless.  Everyone who's said a lot of things has gotten votes and those who've said the least have not.  I should have figured this out sooner and shut up but I wanted to be active considering this is my first game.

##Unvote
##Vote: Fabloo
Nothing against you mate, I'm just joining your wagon like Nucleus suggested so I can at least get to the next stage where we can actually start finding who's scum using our power roles, and its pointless to claim doc, vig or cop since mafia will just nightkill you first and put everyone at a disadvantage.

In response to Polaris' reply its day freaking one, you're right I don't care about scumhunting without data since as its just speculation.  I'd rather base any claims I made on real data like our power roles findings, who the night kill was and votes.  I should have just shut up and lurked as saying anything just makes everyone attack you

[NucleusWaffles]

Alright, so I've figured out the best way to survive day one is to just lurk since without data everything is meaningless.  Everyone who's said a lot of things has gotten votes and those who've said the least have not.  I should have figured this out sooner and shut up but I wanted to be active considering this is my first game.

Tom, are you perchance better with numbers or graphs?

Noting your technological proficiency perhaps you can leverage a strong argument using online times and posting frequencies.

Words are frustrating, don't lose faith.

[Tom]

Indeed I only like to make strong claims backed by evidence such as numbers, and especially power role information.
But its too early since we have no data, post frequencies are circumstantial as people do other things than play mafia.  Which is why I'm just counterattacking whoever attacks me in case they slip up and do something outright scummy.  Anyways I'm not going to dig my own grave anymore and will just lurk for the remainder of the day, if I make it great you'll have someone who will analyze the votes and try to find correlations on your side, if I don't well I've learned the MotK Meta for next time.

[Yaersulf]

I'm down with the idea of lynching Fabloo if that's what we're doing, but personally I'd prefer to wait day or two and see if he's actually just full of hot air or actually has been formulating some grand idea. As rude as it'd be I wouldn't mind a Banana lynch because I still feel like that could give us some possible info on nucleus (and a bunch of other people seeing as nearly everyone weighed in on Bardiche.)

[Yaersulf]

I'd like to see PX weigh in on the Fabloo and Tom bandwagons. Mostly because I keep seeing him on my steam friends list and being reminded that I haven't seen him post in the thread much.