Neo DEFCON Mafia (DEFCON 1, Phase 1)

[Yaersulf]

Aww geez, this is what I get for getting distracted from the game I guess, I should have learned from Abu's example. Ironically I was going to write some words that probably would have included some of this yesterday but then I discovered that SOTN randomiser is a thing. Whoops.

=
Yaer's been on board with being suspicious of Zwerd basically all game, except he's never made a push of his own on Zwerd, never voted for Zwerd, and even on his big reads list featuring the whole playerlist Zwerd wasn't in his most suspicious pool, but he has prodded for thoughts from Zwerd and prodded people to give thoughts about Zwerd.
What this tells me is that Yaer probably knows Zwerd's alignment, and has been intentionally dancing around the lynch. Whether this is because Zwerd is a scumbuddy and he's looking for towncred post-flip for being sus of him in the past? Or he's aware Zwerd is town and has been on board with the read the whole game because he's a likely mislynch candidate and it would justify a switch onto the wagon down the line. I am not confident enough to distinguish which it is at this point.

This seems to be the main allegation against me so I'll explain my thinking on Zwerd so far this game. As I'm sure you all rememeber early D1 Zwerd called for a massclaim, and some people started explaining why that was a bad idea and why that made Zwerd look scummy. Seeing as this was based on analysing why someone would call for a massclaim at the start of D1, and that's something that people who've played more are more qualified to do, I left it to the more experienced players who were already on the case and tried to direct my efforts elsewhere (partially because people keep saying that on this forum lurker!scum tend to get away with just flying under the radar D1 and I was trying to make that harder for them.)

Late D1 to early D2 despite people pushing him pretty hard Zwerd didn't really defend himself (not inherently scummy imo), but also seemed against any measures to actually progress the game and find scum (seems pretty scummy.) At this point I probably should have weighed in with what I thought about it but there didn't seem to be a lot to say, would have been something along the lines of "Yeah I agree that his early D1 massclaim idea was suspicious, mosltly based on the word of more experienced players, and the more he actively doesn't contribute the more and more suspicious of him I'm becoming."

And now Purple!Zwerd shows up and actually starts contributing. This is undoubtedly a reaction to the realisation that if he didn't do something like this he was going to get lynched tonight. Whether that makes him scum is another question, there's two options that I see here.

Option 1: DemoralisedTown!Zwerd tries to do something that he thinks will help D1, gets shut down, and gives up when he realises he's basically signed his own execution order by trying to do something that benefits scum unwittingly. Then D2 he happens to start to care as he's looking to be about to be lynched.

Option 2: Scum!Zwerd tries to do something clever D1 and use the unconventional setup to try and convince people to do something beneficial for scum. Experienced players see through this and call him out, and realising his mistake he gets demoralised and doesn't bother trying to pretend to be town very hard. D2 realising that it's coming to the point where he's imminently going to get lynched for his mistake, possibly encouraged by his scumteam, and seeing an out in the forming train on me, he decides to reinvent himself and drop the baggage from D1.

Is option 1 possible? Yes, but in my limited experience I don't think that the threat of lynching would be what would get a severely demoralised town to start contributing, they'd more likely accept their fate and not mind getting lynched out of the game I'd think. Whereas for scum being lynched is far more serious, with added pressure from their scumteam not wanting them to throw the game.

[Yaersulf]

##Unvote
##Vote:Zwerdjib

[Zoomy Tsugumi]

I'm getting hardcore "scum deciding to hard bus each other" vibes.

[meow56]

Okay, I ISO'd everyone and pulled together a read list. Sorry for wall.

Serela - Seems very sure that there are 4+ town vigs, which doesn't sound right. You'd think town would end up favoring power roles to nukes... Also giving me a lot of newbie cred, though once again under the assumption that we can just nuke me in the end. Though also seems to think nuking me would be a coin toss. Made a case against Bardiche, also willing to lynch zwerdjib. Overall leaning scum.
Daiya - Prodded people d1, gave lots of reads as well. Then disappeared d2. Leaning town, but would like them to get back to the game at some point. Slowly moving down as they've yet to appear.
Beru - Replacing out.
zwerdjib - Seemed to give up on D1, but is back with a vengeance or somesuch. Advocated DEFCON3 massclaim and got lots of flak for it. Getting tunneled on by Dormio. Still think they're town; if they've happened to find the drive to go the distance all the better.
NucleusWaffles - Opens by posting a "breaking" strategy that doesn't really work out, gets lots of flak for it. Thinks Yaersulf is scummy for voteparking, then townie, then scummy again. Has kinda disappeared toDay. I'll place them slightly north of neutral.
Dormio - Very much tunneling on zwerdjib. Gave opinions of others but very limited. Would like to hear more (as raikaria has alluded to). Scum lean.
Yaersulf - I stand by what I said earlier, I feel like Yaersulf should be more confident. The Big Post™ is a little weird, given their posting habits. See also their last game, where they basically gave up re: getting lynched.
Bardiche - Going to wait until they post more before making a decision. Though this wait has been taking a while...
raikaria - Doesn't have a lot of time, but makes the most of what they do have. I like that they've read me enough to actually give a read instead of just saying "lurker". Town.
Zoomy Tsugumi - Is trying to figure this game out, poking people and, like, actually playing the game. Is trying to reinvigorate the town. Town.

Zoomy Tsugumi		Town
zwerdjib
raikaria
Daiya		Town Lean
NucleusWaffles		Neutral
Beru
Bardiche
Dormio		Scum Lean
Serela
Yaersulf		Scum

zwerdjib: You missed Daiya in your read list, so what do you think of them?
Yaersulf: If we mislynched zwerdjib, worst-case leaves us at 4:3:1 tomorrow. At this point I highly doubt any town would lay down and die in the face of a mislynch.
Hopefully Daiya, Bardiche, NucleusWaffles, maybe even Dormio get in here and post something.

[Daiya]

i don't like zwerd's recent posts at all. first he sinks away from his inability to push back against dormio which i'm not convinced wasn't just an omgus case atp, only to provide a read list with little substance and practically no scumreads, which culminates in sheeping the case on yaer? it feels highly opportunistic, and the way he responds to pressure like that feels grimy as fire truck. i'm having a lot of trouble seeing this slot as town

##vote: zwerdjib

 i'm also curious as to why i was omitted from your read list. activity is hardly an excuse there, as you already mentioned beru

@Zoomy: while i do find the case on yaer to be sound, that line of reasoning is a bit dependent on zwerd's alignment. idt it makes much sense to go for him over zwerd as things stand, as long as you believe that zwerd is scummy

[Daiya]

I'm a little confused. There's been a couple of times during this whole thing where Zwerdjib has turned purple and his attitude has almost seemed to change in these purple parts.

And now he appears, with a different avatar, spewing purple posts and being a whole lot more useful.

This development is intriguing. Purple Zwerdjib appears to be the superior Zwerdjib. If this one sticks around, I don't feel like lynching it.

##Unvote

##Vote: yaersulf

I mean, I've already said he's not particually outstanding. I'm happy to go along with the other active players saying he's scummy, even if I just have him as a lurker slot and see no particular reason to lynch this over Beru. But I guess the Beru slot might just get modkilled.

i don't like how easily you were swayed by zwerd's comeback, especially on a basis that's hardly related to his actual content

also, i really don't like your stance at the end and feel that it runs contrary to the townplay i've seen from you. when you saw a lynch occuring that you weren't down for, you fought against it. but that level of conviction just isn't here this time. i let it slide with beru since there really wasn't much time to consolidate, but now? when there's still over a day left? i'm not feeling it. if you don't believe that yaer might actually be scum, then why join the wagon?

furthermore, i'm still curious about your stance on serela. i believe that you scrutinized his case on bard a bit, but apart from that? you've expressed little actual suspicion against him despite making claims that he was waffling multiple times, most recently during this phase. so how exactly does that factor in to your presumably null read on him and why are you more content to push a lurker lynch hat you don't even consider particularly scummy over him?

and zwerd changing his aesthetic is the point. he wants to create that distinction. the blatant theatrics at a time like this makes his slot seem more red than purple to me.

[Daiya]

apologies for the extra bolding

[Yaersulf]

Zoomy if your entire case on me hinges on Zwerd being scum and me being his scumbuddy, could you at least agree to lynch him first seeing as that's where the suspicion comes from. Correct me if I'm wrong but going off what you've said then from your perspective it'd be:

Lynch me I flip scum -> Zwerd is probably scum
Lynch me I flip town -> Initial D1 Zwerd things still apply and you have no more info about Zwerd than before

Lynch Zwerd and he flips scum -> I could be scum
Lynch Zwerd and he flips town -> There's nothing pointing to me being scumbuddies with Zwerd if he's not scum

I.e if you lynch Zwerd there's a chance it gives info about me, but if you lynch me it doesn't give info(or at least far less) about Zwerd.

Of course if we do lynch Zwerd and he flips scum it doesn't look good for me but, well I'd rather take that risk and I guess if it ends up with me getting lynched I'm happy to trade one for one with a scum.

Cut by 3 Daiya posts I haven't read yet.

[zwerdjib]

How tempted I was to say "fire truck this." and quote my post about effort not equating to wins.

How tempted.

But you didn't get that. Sucks to be you.

Aww geez, this is what I get for getting distracted from the game I guess, I should have learned from Abu's example. Ironically I was going to write some words that probably would have included some of this yesterday but then I discovered that SOTN randomiser is a thing. Whoops.

This seems to be the main allegation against me so I'll explain my thinking on Zwerd so far this game. As I'm sure you all rememeber early D1 Zwerd called for a massclaim, and some people started explaining why that was a bad idea and why that made Zwerd look scummy. Seeing as this was based on analysing why someone would call for a massclaim at the start of D1, and that's something that people who've played more are more qualified to do, I left it to the more experienced players who were already on the case and tried to direct my efforts elsewhere (partially because people keep saying that on this forum lurker!scum tend to get away with just flying under the radar D1 and I was trying to make that harder for them.)

Late D1 to early D2 despite people pushing him pretty hard Zwerd didn't really defend himself (not inherently scummy imo), but also seemed against any measures to actually progress the game and find scum (seems pretty scummy.) At this point I probably should have weighed in with what I thought about it but there didn't seem to be a lot to say, would have been something along the lines of "Yeah I agree that his early D1 massclaim idea was suspicious, mosltly based on the word of more experienced players, and the more he actively doesn't contribute the more and more suspicious of him I'm becoming."

And now Purple!Zwerd shows up and actually starts contributing. This is undoubtedly a reaction to the realisation that if he didn't do something like this he was going to get lynched tonight. Whether that makes him scum is another question, there's two options that I see here.

Option 1: DemoralisedTown!Zwerd tries to do something that he thinks will help D1, gets shut down, and gives up when he realises he's basically signed his own execution order by trying to do something that benefits scum unwittingly. Then D2 he happens to start to care as he's looking to be about to be lynched.

Option 2: Scum!Zwerd tries to do something clever D1 and use the unconventional setup to try and convince people to do something beneficial for scum. Experienced players see through this and call him out, and realising his mistake he gets demoralised and doesn't bother trying to pretend to be town very hard. D2 realising that it's coming to the point where he's imminently going to get lynched for his mistake, possibly encouraged by his scumteam, and seeing an out in the forming train on me, he decides to reinvent himself and drop the baggage from D1.

Is option 1 possible? Yes, but in my limited experience I don't think that the threat of lynching would be what would get a severely demoralised town to start contributing, they'd more likely accept their fate and not mind getting lynched out of the game I'd think. Whereas for scum being lynched is far more serious, with added pressure from their scumteam not wanting them to throw the game.

This... isn't reinvention. This has always been present. Whether you've noticed it or not is not within my jurisdiction.

On a related note:

Option 2: Scum!Zwerd tries to do something clever D1 and use the unconventional setup to try and convince people to do something beneficial for scum. Experienced players see through this and call him out, and realising his mistake he gets demoralised and doesn't bother trying to pretend to be town very hard. D2 realising that it's coming to the point where he's imminently going to get lynched for his mistake, possibly encouraged by his scumteam, and seeing an out in the forming train on me, he decides to reinvent himself and drop the baggage from D1.

You think this is because I'm getting lynched? Only partially. But a lot of it is because I've realized that you are the one who has eluded me.

There is no escape.

I'm thunderdoming. Let's duel. No escape.

i don't like zwerd's recent posts at all. first he sinks away from his inability to push back against dormio which i'm not convinced wasn't just an omgus case atp, only to provide a read list with little substance and practically no scumreads, which culminates in sheeping the case on yaer? it feels highly opportunistic, and the way he responds to pressure like that feels grimy as fire truck. i'm having a lot of trouble seeing this slot as town

##vote: zwerdjib

 i'm also curious as to why i was omitted from your read list. activity is hardly an excuse there, as you already mentioned beru

@Zoomy: while i do find the case on yaer to be sound, that line of reasoning is a bit dependent on zwerd's alignment. idt it makes much sense to go for him over zwerd as things stand, as long as you believe that zwerd is scummy

Little substance? No scumreads? Did you read the post, man? The middlepoint is Nucleus. It's probably arbitrary from your perspective, and I apologize for not highlighting that, but it's pretty clear that anything below Nucleus is a candidate for voting.

And I forgot you were in the game. I was going off Dormio's reads post (which should also be scrutinized for literally the exact same reasons that you're ragging on me for) and I suppose I just skipped your name.

Here's your entry, though, since you want it so badly.

Daiya.

He pops in, like the ebb and flow of an ocean, elegance of a swan. But his content is so lacking to me. I'm biased here - on both sides - for obvious reasons, but I can't believe in how much he wants to solve the game. It's not the same feeling as, say, Serela.

i don't like how easily you were swayed by zwerd's comeback, especially on a basis that's hardly related to his actual content

also, i really don't like your stance at the end and feel that it runs contrary to the townplay i've seen from you. when you saw a lynch occuring that you weren't down for, you fought against it. but that level of conviction just isn't here this time. i let it slide with beru since there really wasn't much time to consolidate, but now? when there's still over a day left? i'm not feeling it. if you don't believe that yaer might actually be scum, then why join the wagon?

furthermore, i'm still curious about your stance on serela. i believe that you scrutinized his case on bard a bit, but apart from that? you've expressed little actual suspicion against him despite making claims that he was waffling multiple times, most recently during this phase. so how exactly does that factor in to your presumably null read on him and why are you more content to push a lurker lynch hat you don't even consider particularly scummy over him?

and zwerd changing his aesthetic is the point. he wants to create that distinction. the blatant theatrics at a time like this makes his slot seem more red than purple to me.

Nevermind. I suppose you're fine.

Here's a recent town game for reference. This isn't an act. This is a test of will.



By the way, no one has taken up the suggestion to nuke someone so that we don't need to waste our lynch on certain slots.

Hopefully you can decipher from context what "certain slots" means.

I'm getting hardcore "scum deciding to hard bus each other" vibes.

I feel bad for you, trying to understand the game like this. Rationalizing certain interactions only helps post-flip, though. It's true that you need to look at things through multiple perspectives in Mafia, but from years of experience, sometimes thinking that we live in X universe or Y world is going to blind you to the alternatives.

Zoomy if your entire case on me hinges on Zwerd being scum and me being his scumbuddy, could you at least agree to lynch him first seeing as that's where the suspicion comes from. Correct me if I'm wrong but going off what you've said then from your perspective it'd be:

Lynch me I flip scum -> Zwerd is probably scum
Lynch me I flip town -> Initial D1 Zwerd things still apply and you have no more info about Zwerd than before

Lynch Zwerd and he flips scum -> I could be scum
Lynch Zwerd and he flips town -> There's nothing pointing to me being scumbuddies with Zwerd if he's not scum

I.e if you lynch Zwerd there's a chance it gives info about me, but if you lynch me it doesn't give info(or at least far less) about Zwerd.

Of course if we do lynch Zwerd and he flips scum it doesn't look good for me but, well I'd rather take that risk and I guess if it ends up with me getting lynched I'm happy to trade one for one with a scum.

Cut by 3 Daiya posts I haven't read yet.

Lynch me I flip scum -> Zwerd is probably scum

Excuse me? How did you form this conclusion, again?

Do you itch to die? Do you want to take me with you, knowing that I'm guaranteed to be lynched if - no, when, you flip mafia?

Insisting on your death is not a bright idea, regardless of your alignment; but if you believe you'll indict me (despite the fact that your lynch definitely gives more info about my slot than vice versa) then I can't help but see this as a scummy move.

In other words: I won't grant you that satisfaction.



_{Unrelated note: I picked purple because it's my favorite color and the color of regality.}

[zwerdjib]

...madamada pawa o kanjiru

[Zoomy Tsugumi]

@Zoomy: while i do find the case on yaer to be sound, that line of reasoning is a bit dependent on zwerd's alignment. idt it makes much sense to go for him over zwerd as things stand, as long as you believe that zwerd is scummy

Zoomy if your entire case on me hinges on Zwerd being scum and me being his scumbuddy, could you at least agree to lynch him first seeing as that's where the suspicion comes from.

Let me go check votecounts to see what Zwerd and Yaer are at first before I change anything around.

[Zoomy Tsugumi]

Zwerd (4): Dormio, Zoomy Tsugumi, Raikaria, Serela, Yaersulf, Daiya
Yaersulf (4): Meow56, NucleusWaffles, Zoomy Tsugumi, Zwerdjib, Raikaria

Should be the current standings on both their wagons for the whole day. So they're both currently at L-2.
##Unvote
Well, to avoid L-1 shennanigans I'm openly stating my intent to vote for Zwerd, so consider yourself at L-1, can we get a claim?

[zwerdjib]

Zwerd (4): Dormio, Zoomy Tsugumi, Raikaria, Serela, Yaersulf, Daiya
Yaersulf (4): Meow56, NucleusWaffles, Zoomy Tsugumi, Zwerdjib, Raikaria

Should be the current standings on both their wagons for the whole day. So they're both currently at L-2.
##Unvote
Well, to avoid L-1 shennanigans I'm openly stating my intent to vote for Zwerd, so consider yourself at L-1, can we get a claim?

I... literally claimed at daystart.

Air Base.

Everyone seems to ignore the fact that despite asking for a massclaim I literally claimed Bulletproof Townie. As the first person.

Also, read the previous page; there's a post you'll definitely want to look at.

[Yaersulf]

Yaer.

Zoomy, for the most part, has explained this for me. However, I would like to add that, to my memory, this is similar gameplay to his YS game.

Note: Zoomy's argument involvles Zwerd himself being scum.

I suppose now the question is asked: what next?

We can see if pressuring Yaer will get us anywhere. If he's town, we reevaluate. If he's scum, we look off of the wagon.

You think this is because I'm getting lynched? Only partially. But a lot of it is because I've realized that you are the one who has eluded me.

There is no escape.

I'm thunderdoming. Let's duel. No escape.

This doesn't seem to be very consistent to me.

I don't need to fight you if you're already fighting yourself. :V

[Yaersulf]

I guess I should ask, what makes you think I've scum Zwerd that isn't me being scumbuddies with you?

[Yaersulf]

Words are hard.

What makes you think I'm scum Zwerd, that isn't Zoomy's case that I'm your scumbuddy.

[Zoomy Tsugumi]

I... literally claimed at daystart.

Air Base.

Everyone seems to ignore the fact that despite asking for a massclaim I literally claimed Bulletproof Townie. As the first person.

Also, read the previous page; there's a post you'll definitely want to look at.

Gosh ur right lmao I totally forgot.
Anyway I'm not sure which post you're referring to so feel free to help me along here.

[zwerdjib]

Oh hang on I think I found something big on Yaer?
Here's every post of Yaer's pertaining to Zwerd in some manner.

Spoiler:

Yaer's been on board with being suspicious of Zwerd basically all game, except he's never made a push of his own on Zwerd, never voted for Zwerd, and even on his big reads list featuring the whole playerlist Zwerd wasn't in his most suspicious pool, but he has prodded for thoughts from Zwerd and prodded people to give thoughts about Zwerd.
What this tells me is that Yaer probably knows Zwerd's alignment, and has been intentionally dancing around the lynch. Whether this is because Zwerd is a scumbuddy and he's looking for towncred post-flip for being sus of him in the past? Or he's aware Zwerd is town and has been on board with the read the whole game because he's a likely mislynch candidate and it would justify a switch onto the wagon down the line. I am not confident enough to distinguish which it is at this point.

Either way
##Unvote
##Vote:Yaersulf

This implies scumbuddies? I’m leaning toward the TMI push.

Gosh ur right lmao I totally forgot.
Anyway I'm not sure which post you're referring to so feel free to help me along here.

Yaer quoted it. Follow the link.

[Zoomy Tsugumi]

Yeah uh, if it's your reads post I'm not really sure what I need to pay attention to there either.

[zwerdjib]

Yeah uh, if it's your reads post I'm not really sure what I need to pay attention to there either.

*sigh*

[raikaria]

So MotK as down when I woke up and I gotta go to work and it's just come back so prod dodgeing atm for when I'm back from work.

OFC content happens when I sleep.

[Bardiche]

I was gonna post but I collapsed and wound up in the hospital lol

I'm going through the thread and trying to gather my thoughts, but isn't Bulletproof the sort of thing you don't claim, so you can draw the Scum/3P NK and survive anyway? Silly Zwerdjib.

[Dormio Ergo Sum]

Oh hey the site is back.

[Dormio Ergo Sum]

Anyway, zwerdjib's attempt to force a 1v1 between himself and Yaersulf (when Yaersulf was already the leading counterwagon) seems like a really last-ditch effort to try to cast suspicion away from himself. I like my vote where it is.

[Bardiche]

Glad Zwerdjib decided to break the flow on DEFCON2. Not sure I'm entirely fond of leaning on Raikaria/Zoomy opinions for reads on others, especially on Yaer. Like, literally, "vote Yaer, trust me" followed by "Zoomy made the case for me, plus it's similar to Ys gameplay." Also don't really like, "Daiya's content is lacking" and then two lines later "Nevermind he's fine."

It's because the amount of effort I put in is vastly disproportionate to the odds that we win the game.

This is ironic because until now, almost no effort was put in.

[Bardiche]

Back to my favourite player, Serela. And by favourite, I mean would nuke/10 player. If only I had a nuke to deploy.

Recommended reading: Exh A.

I think dormio looks fine enough right now, been trying to figure out where I stand on zwerd and I don't know which is why I haven't been commenting on it much

On a re-read I really just don't like this line. It's commenting on the Dormio/Zwerd spat, while covering his base to vote Zwerdjib later on if it seems Dormio'll get traction... while at the same time making it easy to clear Zwerd with a "I decided he's Town" read.

Which you'll note Serela lightly does here and then again here, basically insisting he doesn't want to lynch Zwerd despite not actually having ever stated a read on Zwerd one way or the other. Nor any apparent attempt to change that.

You'll note that part of his case on me notes my attack on Zwerdjib. Interestingly, Serela's interest in a zwerdjib lynch grows at this point when the game's essentially in deadlock.

Meaning, it's a perfect time to prepare yourself for a "I was part of that wagon!!" moment and bus a buddy.

When Serela finally does vote Zwerd, there's been virtually nothing he's written on Zwerd since the first post I linked other than "not interested in a zwerd lynch".

Basically, if we lynch Zwerd and he flips Scum, that just goes to show Serela's Scum, too. This level of reasoning is possible when you're recovering.

[Bardiche]

So let's talk Dormio, since he was a thing for Nucleus (reminder to self: Nucleus proposed lynching Dormio early, gotta see if he made an attempt to even divine Dormio's alignment lately).

Also interesting to note Zwerd townread Raikaria by the time Dormio voted him, which is rather early to be locking yourself into townreads like that. Think I agree with Dormio in that it's a bit weird to marry yourself off to someone because they explained basic game theory.

There's not much else to Dormio other than an unhealthy obsession with Zwerd, but I don't think he's been particularly bad about it. I similarly don't really enjoy building cases that amount to nothing more than "this player doesn't post much": in this post I'm pretty much in agreement that there's smol pickings from the active playerbase, though I'm kind of baffled he neglected to mention me, since he had a high opinion of me before.

What's your opinion now, Dormio?

[Bardiche]

Yaersulf puts into words his gameplay: "Nobody else seems to have done anything suspicious, so I guess I'll just try to make people say words."

I don't think admitting to not having any scumreads and being this open and frank is really symbolic of a scum-minded player. Coupled with that honesty, I'm inclined to take his NK confusion at face-value and assume he truly expected an NK to occur. There's no value for scum to talk about it, because they'd already know they can't NK.

One point I do think looks odd is claiming he has an eye on Zwerd but then not mentioning him whatsoever until zwerd made the top 3 most lynchable.

Can you explain for me, Yaer, why you just didn't talk about him much? Like others said, it's like you've been avoiding saying much on Zwerd while keeping the option open. You said you were DTL Abu and Meow but why haven't you expanded on that much since then either?

It looks like you had some opinions but don't care enough to hold them particularly long, so I'm interested in an explanation for this odd behaviour.

[Bardiche]

In summation, I re-read DEFCON 2, and am of the opinion that Serela is still very much worth lynching. Zwerdjib's got that entire "I'm so demotivated" vibe going after Dormio votes him, and I think it's a little weird to just claim effort disproportionate to odds of winning game. Not like I've been a shining beacon of EFFORT, and I agree putting in a lot of effort doesn't always come appreciated, but to just completely drop off and strawberriespost is another thing altogether.

Kinda similar to Nucleus's audaciously insane behaviour.

Speaking of, don't like the misrep from his side on "Bard's def of Dormio was the big thing", though I guess for him it must be true. But most notably, townreads Yaer based on Zoomy, then votes Yaer because he suddenly dropped in activity and switched style.

Kind of a big leap from "I think he's town" to "let's lynch him he's scum".

Note that Nucleus actually voted Yaer before, because he was a major scumread.

So the chronology goes:
Nucleus scumreads Yaersulf for voteparking
Nucleus votes Yaersulf for "switching voting styles"
Nucleus townreads Yaersulf for "Yaer likes using his vote as a baton"
Nucleus votes Yaersulf for "switching voting styles"

Basically, Yaersulf bad for vote parking. Yaersulf bad for not voteparking. Yaersulf Town for not voteparking. Yaersulf scum for--

Yeah.

It's a completely inconsistent and illogical, same with I townread Bard to accusing me of chainsaw defending and dreaming up a Bard/Dormio scumteam.

Basically, Nucleus doesn't seem married to any of his opinions and changes them on the fly, possibly because his scumreads are just inventions of the time.

##Vote: NucleusWaffles
And I'm 100% comfortable now that this should be a more major focus than Serela.

[Bardiche]

Basically, the initial plan to get everyone to nuke everyone is 3P-minded. Posting all sorts of unclear nonsense is obfuscating and unhelpful. And now constantly swapping his reads around to whatever is convenient at the time just reads like someone whose investment in the game is no more than a passing fancy.

I think a real Townie would be informed by his suspicions. That's to say...

If I think someone hates me, then I assume they're being sarcastic when they say, "Nice shoes you've got."
If I think someone likes me, then I assume that same comment is a compliment.

I don't think it's possible for a Townie who heavily suspects Yaersulf of scum to suddenly read his actions in a Townie way, but then flop around immediately again to distrust at the drop of a hat.